That Was Fast: Oklahoma State Football’s Return to the Top 25 Already Started

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21

No, no, no. I’m not saying there is an expectation of winning 8 by the powers that be. Nor am I changing my prediction of what Morris/OSU will do. You said that if he wins 6 in year 1, that he needs to win 8 in year 2. You scoffed at my prediction of him winning 7/8 in year 1, but you hunk the bat should be set at 8 in year 2?

Of course it’s “easier” to turn a program around quicker now than it used to be. You can do it in year 1 at an Indiana now, where you couldn’t in the past. But that doesn’t mean it’s the expectation in year 1 at a place like Stillwater. That’s crazy talk. If someone is expecting more/the same out of Morris in year 1 than they did out of Gundy in year 21? That’s crazy talk

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Ok, all I said was win more than 4. I like how you’re slipping “powers that be” expectations and your own in where it’s convenient and the opposite for me. Maybe we should settle on one or the other. My five wins is the lowest bar set by anyone on this board. Someone said I was using drugs because I didn’t set the floor at 8 wins. You’re saying 8. Lots of people at 6 or 7.

Schedule blind, this feels like a 5 win team. I think the school should feel good about 5 wins. I personally think, because of the schedule, 6 or 7 wins could happen. 4 wins is an under performance, but even if he goes winless, I don’t think he should be fired after one season.

Not being a turd, but I do not know what “hunk the bat” was supposed to be. Yes, if you win 6 in year one, you had what? 17 players carried over from UNT including a top 5 portal QB entering his junior year, a second recruiting class, another portal class, and only Tech and BYU with significantly higher resources (I think), yes 8 wins. He’d have a high chemistry team playing together with a veteran QB. When is it going to be aligned better than that? Mestemaker signed for two years, so no guarantee he gets a senior year to run it back.

Indiana can do it in the Big 10, then we should be able to get lesser results in the Big XII. I didn’t say win a nat in year two or even make the conference title game, I said improve your WL by two games.

You like to say “crazy talk” a lot. I am expecting it.

Summary of Gundy’s fireable offense: Gundy is a relic that can’t adjust to portal era. He had a veteran team that inexplicably went from 9 wins to 3. He then could not rebuild the team from the studs in one season within three games from the portal and with all new coaches. He chose bad coordinators. He didn’t get enough talent. He alienated boosters.

If the new guy comes in with a veteran squad, savvy with NIL, brings his coaches over, then he better be better at those things. He better be able to rebuild quickly, he better get improved results as his team gains experience, he better be making good coach hires and buy the best talent we can afford. If he were to win 6 this year, I’ll bet every publication is going to predict them 8 wins the following year off of momentum. That’s not “crazy talk”.

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23

Hang on, hang on. Youre all over the place here. I said initially that theyd win 7/8 games next year. I havent waffled on that at all. “Hunk the bat”, predictive text with no proofreading. My apologies. Yes, you seem to be expecting more out of Morris in his first or 2nd year than you did in Gundys 21st. That to me, is crazy talk. By anyone. I have no clue how someone would rationalize that. At no point did I say someone predicting him to win 8 was crazy. What I said was someone EXPECTING him to win 8 in year 1 is crazy. Someone saying Eric Morris failed to meet EXPECTATIONS by not winning 8 in his first year, is crazy talk. Someone EXPECTING Morris to win 8 in year 1, but excusing Gundy for not winning 8 in year 20…is crazy talk.

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Ok, well, I didn’t say he should win 8 in year one. I said if he wins 6 in year one then he will be expected by literally everyone to win 8 in year two. That’s barring serious injury and without knowing the schedule and how teams shake out this year.

If he wins 6 this year and 7 the next year, should he be fired? No. Obviously not, but that result isn’t going to make anyone happy. There are “reset” years where you expect less and there are years where you expect growth. Year 2 will be one everyone is expecting growth.

I don’t even understand where you’re coming from with this “expecting more from Gundy in year 21”.

1.) Gundy got fired, so clearly the expectation was not met. So what are you talking about?
2.) As a comparison, a hypothetical year 2 Morris is going to (probably) have:

  • A six win team (let’s say) with a third year starting QB, continuity all over the field, continuity coaching, the good will of the admin and fans and boosters, momentum.
    Year 21 Gundy:
  • scrapped 90% of a 3 win team, scrapped 90% of the coaching staff, had a first time starting QB and then a backup first time starting QB, had publicly fought with the admin, had little support of the fans and boosters (call it 100% his fault, doesn’t matter), and only coached three games.

Yes, 100% there would be more expectations for year 2 Morris. If you flipped the circumstances, I’d have more expectation for Gundy probably. That’s a spot where I might expect Gundy to snag a 10 win season. However, you’re talking crazy if you don’t think you fire a guy and expect the new guy to do better, so the expectations should be higher.

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First off, this is a solid response. I think were on track for a solid give/take.

“If he wins 6 this year and 7 the next year,…but that result isn’t going to make anyone happy”. I disagree. Every program has fans on the lunatic fringe. I dont think the lucid/sane OSU fan would have a problem with progression from Year 1 to Year 2, even if its simply by 1 more W. Oklahoma St has certainly seen a change in the climate of their fan base, but not to the extent of being unhappy with a guy in Year 2 continuing to win.
"I don’t even understand where you’re coming from with this “expecting more from Gundy in year 21”. There have been things posted on here, I believe by you as well, that hint at or have said as much that Morris should be expected to win 8 games in year 2. Those people were the same that were giving excuses for Gundy in years 20 and 21. That does not make sense, in any way. You cannot paint the porous Gundy picture as an excuse for why he shouldve been given more time…when he was the one that created his circumstances. Gundy had more of a hand in the direction of his program than any HC in the country. He certainly had more of the steering wheel in year 20 and 21 than Morris does right now. Thats inarguable, unless someone is a moron.
“Year 21 Gundy” You and I have had some discussions about Gundy, his firing, and the timing (most notably the claim that it was illegal/immoral to have negotations). In most of those, you continue to somehow give Gundy a pass or seemingly an excuse based on the circumstances at OSU…even though he is the one who created his own set of circumstances. He had the keys to the OSU program and after much success, he drove it into the ditch. That is/was/always will be on Gundy. No one else. “call it 100% his fault, doesnt matter” It ABSOLUTELY MATTERS.

Morris scrapped more than 90% of a program that hasnt won a conf game in 2 years. Scrapped more than 90% of the coaching staff. An expectation is saying someone SHOULD do something. I guarantee you that there are Cowboy fans from from cheap seats all the way up to the Boosters who hope, predict, wish for Morris to turn this thing around in Year1 and be in the Conf title game sooner than later. I can also guarantee you that NONE of those high dollar Boosters EXPECT that to be the case, because with an expectation comes the perceived failure of not meeting said expectation. No one is going to claim a failure of Morris if he goes from something like 5 wins to 7. Holding Morris to a lofty expectation right now, coming from the doormat, is…CRAZY TALK.

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As with all OSU coaches I am rooting for him. I think he is a good coach but that doesn’t always translate to success at a given program. The unfortunate thing for Lutz is the era for giving MBB coaches 5 or more years to get OSU back to the glory years is over or at least it should be. We have tried that with the previous couple of coaches and it has fallen short of the goal.

27

I will hold Morris to the Gundy standard. He needs 4 wins in year one. I personally think he’ll get to 6. I’m not so sure beyond that though. I’m not worried about the offense this coming season. What I’m most intrigued by is if we can have at least a top 50 defense.

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28

What? It’s like 20 players he has been coaching. They’re just moving up I-35. He brought a lot of his staff from UNT to coach including his front office guys. That’s not 90% turnover. That’s like 75% retention. Yes, he should win a minimum of 5 games with that much continuity. That’s all G6 retention and you can’t expect them to come in and be dominant against P4 competition, but knocking off some of the lower half of the conference plus Murray State and Tulsa? Yes. Absolute expectation.

29

Dude, I dont know where youre getting your info from or youre just really bad at math. OSU will roster probably 100 guys (give or take a couple depending what they do). There are 17 that will have been with him at North Texas. So he will have 83 new faces. So just by the numbers, 83% (17 of 100) will be new faces to him.

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A lot of those 100 guys are never going to see the field in meaningful minutes.

You’re talking about having like 15 of 22 starters returning. Because he’s changing schools, we’re acting like he’s reconstructing a roster? Please. Most coaches would beg for that level of continuity, especially in 2026. You’ll have rotational players, package-specific guys, injury replacements, but when you take all of the minutes and snaps, the majority of those minutes and snaps are going to be the same guys who played those minutes and took those snaps for him last year with a lot of the same coaches he coached with last year.

31

First off, you are once again moving the goalposts. Its 83% percent turnover. “15 of 22 starters returning”. This is just misinformed on your part. He is bringing 17 players with him. 9 of the 17 were heavy contributors. The other 8 combined for 0 rushing yds, 11 catches, 2 INT’s & 1 sack. You also brought in their long snapper. You are really returning a QB, RB, WR (x2), OL (x2), S, LB.

If you think thats similar to returning 15 of 22, then youre nuts

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32

33% of his years here Gundy went 6-6 or worse in the regular season. Just keeping things in perspective.

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